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Should Translation Be Mixed with Personal Understanding and/or Explanation?
Autor wątku: coolfool
QHE
USA
Local time: 16:56
angielski > chiński
+ ...
hanging over Mar 24

David Lin wrote:
听说唐朝许多诗人都喜欢喝酒(以李白为最)。
有可能作者晚上喝了不少,醒来头昏脑胀,有点儿眼花缭乱,不如修改为:

Hanging over from the spring night, unaware of dawning;
The birds are everywhere, singing.

ysun wrote:
你这次修改后的版本中,"Hanging over" 形容的仍然是 "The birds";你用的那个 semicolon 照样是错的。我前面提供的那些参考链接看来都是白费了!


    译文图解:



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ysun  Identity Verified
USA
Local time: 15:56
angielski > chiński
+ ...
Grammar rules Mar 24

Occasionally when necessary, I may have to talk about some of the grammar rules since they would help us understand source texts and render them correctly into target languages, and they would also help us avoid personal misunderstandings, as shown in this discussion so far.

[Edited at 2017-03-26 01:21 GMT]


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Fargoer
Kanada
Local time: 14:56
angielski > chiński
Good examples Mar 25

coolfool wrote:

One more here:



[修改时间: 2017-03-25 05:02 GMT]


The sentence was translated word by word without an understanding of the whole thing.

[修改时间: 2017-03-25 06:04 GMT]


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Rita Pang  Identity Verified
Kanada
Local time: 16:56
Członek ProZ.com
od 2011

chiński > angielski
+ ...

Moderator tego forum
excellent photoshop skills Mar 25

QHE wrote:

译文图解:





可別說,我一看居然看不出那對手和茶杯是P上去的
第二次才看到,笑得我~


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wherestip  Identity Verified
USA
Local time: 15:56
chiński > angielski
+ ...
Hangovers Mar 25

Rita Pang wrote:

QHE wrote:

译文图解:





可別說,我一看居然看不出那對手和茶杯是P上去的
第二次才看到,笑得我~






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ysun  Identity Verified
USA
Local time: 15:56
angielski > chiński
+ ...
Understanding the difference between "hang over" (phrasal verb) and "hangover" (noun) Mar 25

QHE wrote:

ysun wrote:
你这次修改后的版本中,"Hanging over" 形容的仍然是 "The birds";你用的那个 semicolon 照样是错的。我前面提供的那些参考链接看来都是白费了!

Those links provide useful information about some basic rules of English grammar. I am sure that most of the colleagues here are also quite familiar with these basics. Besides, I think we should understand the difference between "hang over" (phrasal verb) and "hangover" (noun) before we can use them correctly.

Hangover (noun)
http://www.ldoceonline.com/dictionary/hangover
hang‧o‧ver /ˈhæŋəʊvə $ -oʊvər/ ●○○ noun [countable]

1 a pain in your head and a feeling of sickness that you get the day after you have drunk too much alcohol
I had a terrible hangover the next day.

Hang over (phrasal verb)
http://www.ldoceonline.com/dictionary/hang-over
hang over something/somebody

if something bad is hanging over you, you are worried or anxious about it
The threat of redundancy was still hanging over us.
It’s not very nice to have huge debts hanging over your head.

It is incorrect to say that "They were hanging over this morning, unaware of dawning". However, it is all right to say that "They were hungover this morning, unaware of dawning" (meaning they felt ill this morning because they drank too much alcohol last night).

-----------------------------------------------
Another example of hanging over:

Hanging over his head, the sword was tied up with the hair of a horse.

It is the sword (not he, nor the horse) that was hanging over his head.

ysun wrote:

You will see more clearly what I mean if you read the following about the use of present participle as an adverbial clause:

https://learnenglish.britishcouncil.org/en/quick-grammar/participle-clauses
Participle clauses
Participle clauses are a form of adverbial clause which enables us to say information in a more economical way. We can use participle clauses when the participle and the verb in the main clause have the same subject. For example:

Waiting for John, I made some tea.

Waiting for John, the kettle boiled. [This would suggest that the kettle was waiting for John!]



[Edited at 2017-03-26 13:07 GMT]


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ysun  Identity Verified
USA
Local time: 15:56
angielski > chiński
+ ...
Illustration of the above example Mar 25

Hanging over his head, the sword was tied up with the hair of a horse.

10m


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ysun  Identity Verified
USA
Local time: 15:56
angielski > chiński
+ ...
Interpreting the pictures based on my understanding Mar 27

QHE wrote:

David Lin wrote:
听说唐朝许多诗人都喜欢喝酒(以李白为最)。
有可能作者晚上喝了不少,醒来头昏脑胀,有点儿眼花缭乱,不如修改为:

Hanging over from the spring night, unaware of dawning;
The birds are everywhere, singing.

ysun wrote:
你这次修改后的版本中,"Hanging over" 形容的仍然是 "The birds";你用的那个 semicolon 照样是错的。我前面提供的那些参考链接看来都是白费了!


    译文图解:



wherestip wrote:




Having a hangover this morning, the birds were unaware of dawning and unable to sing in any places.

Grammatically, I believe this sentence is correct.

[Edited at 2017-03-28 00:17 GMT]


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coolfool
Chiny
Local time: 04:56
chiński > angielski
NOWY TEMAT
The United States Government Road? Mar 29

http://img.zjolcdn.com/pic/0/06/45/83/6458312_180153.jpg

http://zj.sina.com.cn/news/d/2014-10-26/detail-ianfzhnk0081533.shtml
http://zjnews.zjol.com.cn/system/2014/10/25/020323030.shtml
http://news.sohu.com/20141026/n405463471.shtml


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Fargoer
Kanada
Local time: 14:56
angielski > chiński
Machine translation Mar 29



Machine doesn't understand anything.


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ysun  Identity Verified
USA
Local time: 15:56
angielski > chiński
+ ...
Word-by-word translation Apr 1

Fargoer wrote:

coolfool wrote:

One more here:



[修改时间: 2017-03-25 05:02 GMT]

The sentence was translated word by word without an understanding of the whole thing.

在中文里‘老’字具有‘总是’的含义,但英文 old 却没有这层含义。“How are you?” 与 “How old are you?” 都是最基本的英文句型,连英语初学者都能理解。如果连最基本的词义都不理解,连最基本的英文文法都不懂,还谈得上什么翻译?


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Fargoer
Kanada
Local time: 14:56
angielski > chiński
笑话 Apr 1

ysun wrote:

Fargoer wrote:

coolfool wrote:

One more here:



[修改时间: 2017-03-25 05:02 GMT]

The sentence was translated word by word without an understanding of the whole thing.

在中文里‘老’字具有‘总是’的含义,但英文 old 却没有这层含义。“How are you?” 与 “How old are you?” 都是最基本的英文句型,连英语初学者都能理解。如果连最基本的词义都不理解,连最基本的英文文法都不懂,还谈得上什么翻译?


您不觉得这是聪明人编造出来的笑话吗?每个英文词都按词典译出,像是跟挑毛病的人叫板。 "old" 一词译为"老",持之有故且又巧妙利用了“老”的双关,使得句子通顺有意义,还与前面一句的意思连贯起来。真的很佩服作者的才气!


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ysun  Identity Verified
USA
Local time: 15:56
angielski > chiński
+ ...
仍不失为极好的例子 Apr 2

Fargoer wrote:

您不觉得这是聪明人编造出来的笑话吗?每个英文词都按词典译出,像是跟挑毛病的人叫板。 "old" 一词译为"老",持之有故且又巧妙利用了“老”的双关,使得句子通顺有意义,还与前面一句的意思连贯起来。真的很佩服作者的才气!

我虽愚钝,但还是很清楚,这是聪明人编造出来的笑话。我只是揣着明白装糊涂而已。 不过,此笑话仍不失为一个极好的例子,用来说明问题。你用来说明,“translated word by word without an understanding of the whole thing” 是会闹笑话的。我用来说明“如果连最基本的词义都不理解,连最基本的英文文法都不懂,还谈得上什么翻译?” 这也可谓一个原则 (understanding),你我各自表述也。

同样,“下雨天留客天留我不留”这句话,很可能也是聪明人编造出来,以说明标点符号的重要性。在古时候,人们写文章一般不加标点符号,而是通过语感、语气助词、语法结构等来断句。但这样有时仍会产生歧义、造成误解。所以人们就逐渐开始使用标点符号。当然,在某些情况下,如果不用标点符号,也可用其他方式来断句。例如:

下雨天留客
天留我不留

下雨天
留客天
留我不


David Lin 在前面所举的英文诗一例,也是以同样方式断句,所以不会造成误解。但如果由此推而广之,得出“标点符号及英文文法,都不算什么”的结论,那就是以点代面、以偏概全了。

David Lin wrote:

只要看看这首英诗就更加清楚,标点符号及英文文法,都不算什么!

someones married their everyones
laughed their cryings and did their dance
(sleep wake hope and then)they
said their nevers they slept their dream

all by all and deep by deep
and more by more they dream their sleep
noone and anyone earth by april
with by spirit and if by yes.


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Fargoer
Kanada
Local time: 14:56
angielski > chiński
是啊, Apr 2

ysun wrote:

仍不失为极好的例子

 


这是讽刺没有理解的翻译的绝妙例子。


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Fargoer
Kanada
Local time: 14:56
angielski > chiński
这样的笑话很多 Apr 2

ysun wrote:
  不过,此笑话仍不失为一个极好的例子,用来说明问题。 


KFC 有句著名的广告词: At KFC, we do chicken right!

有人翻译为:我们在肯德基做鸡是对的!


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