| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] > | Offering services free of charge Thread poster: Sandra Petch
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Yes, you do have a point. However, I think the far bigger concern will always be the people who will offer their services for mere 30~50% of the usual price in pair, than those who will do it for free.
Absolutely, Miroslav; I can only second that.
| | | | Niraja Nanjundan (X) 
Local time: 08:55
German to English
| Talking of which.... | May 10, 2010 |
Fiona Peterson wrote:
Pay peanuts, get monkeys
...there's a new blog by the same name which discusses these issues. Although I've read this *so* many times in the ProZ forums now, that I'm quite fed up of it, the blog is quite humourous and has links to some good articles on it, so do have a look:
http://nopeanuts.wordpress.com/
| | | | Rebekka Groß (X)
Local time: 04:25
English to German
| don't agree with offering services for free | May 10, 2010 |
here on ProZ.com. If it really bugs you, submit a support request alerting staff to the profile in question. There may or may not be a rule that says users/members are not allowed to advertise their services for free on ProZ.com. If there isn't perhaps it's time it was added.
Edited to add the following:
If someone is so new to the profession wants to offer their services for free to gain experience, maybe they should do an internship in an agency for a few months instead. At ... See more here on ProZ.com. If it really bugs you, submit a support request alerting staff to the profile in question. There may or may not be a rule that says users/members are not allowed to advertise their services for free on ProZ.com. If there isn't perhaps it's time it was added.
Edited to add the following:
If someone is so new to the profession wants to offer their services for free to gain experience, maybe they should do an internship in an agency for a few months instead. At least, they'd get paid and gain some experience.
If anyone really wants to offer their services for free, they should find a worthwhile cause, such as a charity that really can't afford to pay for translation services.
[Edited at 2010-05-10 13:42 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Tim Drayton
Cyprus
Local time: 06:25
Turkish to English
+ ...
| In my experience, it does not work commercially | May 10, 2010 |
Years ago I was running a small agency. At a desperate time when little work was coming in, I had the bright idea of sending a mailing to potential commercial clients containing the offer to do a sample free translation of up to (if I remember correctly) 500 words. The idea, of course, was that they would get a free translation, be impressed and order more paid work later.
Guess what? Several companies took up the offer of a free translation. Did I ever hear from any of them again? ... See more Years ago I was running a small agency. At a desperate time when little work was coming in, I had the bright idea of sending a mailing to potential commercial clients containing the offer to do a sample free translation of up to (if I remember correctly) 500 words. The idea, of course, was that they would get a free translation, be impressed and order more paid work later.
Guess what? Several companies took up the offer of a free translation. Did I ever hear from any of them again? No.
So, in my experience this kind of 'supermarket tactic' does not work in our sector. ▲ Collapse
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Jessica Noyes
United States
Local time: 23:25
Member
Spanish to English
+ ...
| Volunteer lisitng on ProZ | May 10, 2010 |
It might be helpful for ProZ to maintain a list of charities that seek donated translations, so that translators can easily find these organizations. It would also be a link to which we could refer newbies who post their desire to work for free.
For example, Idealist.org maintains a large listing for many languages, -- both interpreters and translators. The site itself is multi-lingual.
| | | | Sandra Petch
Local time: 05:25
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Sheila Wilson wrote:
I don't mean heavy-handed action - just a note saying "You're new here so let me give you some advice: we don't do it like that here! If you want to translate for free, please register with charities and with sites where it's normal. On ProZ, please offer your services in a professional way."
Can I suggest you send this translator a note, Sandra?
Hi Sheila
You know, I probably should have done that instead of posting here but I was so taken aback I wanted to see how other translators felt.
I'm certain this person just wants to gain experience and means no harm at all. Pointing them towards a volunteer service such as Translators Without Borders would do the trick.
All the best.
| | | | | Why not do it for free for a cause | May 10, 2010 |
Jessica Noyes wrote:
It might be helpful for ProZ to maintain a list of charities that seek donated translations, so that translators can easily find these organizations. It would also be a link to which we could refer newbies who post their desire to work for free.
For example, Idealist.org maintains a large listing for many languages, -- both interpreters and translators. The site itself is multi-lingual.
I believe that it would be interesting to list ONGs (as the Rosetta Foundation) who desperately need help from volunteer translators...
I also don't really see a problem if someone decides to market his/her services a certain way...Marketing your services and your rates are up to you ! Even though they may be harming others in the "absolute" they're just doing business the way it serves their interests best ! I can't really picture someone offering low rates for the sake of offering them at some point he's bound to make some kind of profit and if he does I don't really see why he/she would care about the losses I'm having...
The real issue here is whether Proz wants to support/protect its paying members by banning ridiculous offers ! I truly believe that ProZ should take a majority vote (amongst paying members) to solve the issue completely...
| | | | | Just wondering ... | May 10, 2010 |
I know this is not exactly what this thread is about but the question of free translations just came up for me:
These days I got a *very* short text from a direct client for whom I have already done several translations before. It was rather scientific, as usual with this client, but now I am really in doubt whether I should charge him for this or not. It did not take me more than one hour to do the translation, including searching for the special vocabulary and with my normal rate... See more I know this is not exactly what this thread is about but the question of free translations just came up for me:
These days I got a *very* short text from a direct client for whom I have already done several translations before. It was rather scientific, as usual with this client, but now I am really in doubt whether I should charge him for this or not. It did not take me more than one hour to do the translation, including searching for the special vocabulary and with my normal rate it would not be more than about 2,50 euros. Normally I would have put it on the next invoice but in this case they told me they want to have the invoice right now because the person in charge is leaving and wants to close this project but I'm hesitant...
How do you cope with things like these? Probably they are not so uncommon ▲ Collapse
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Hi Charlotte,
I do a free translation now and then for clients for whom I have worked for several years. Sending 100 words for free from time to time doesn't really ruin me.
It did not take me more than one hour to do the translation, including searching for the special vocabulary and with my normal rate it would not be more than about 2,50 euros.
However, I think it's high time you thought about raising your rates. € 2.50 per less than an hour, if it's not three minutes, is not exactly what I would like to work for.
Nah, sorry. Just being a little sarcastic...
| | | | Sandra Petch
Local time: 05:25
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Hi Charlotte
I'm happy to do small texts for free for regular/favourite clients, usually a paragraph or two. It does them a favour and saves messing around with quotes and order forms for a few euros.
What concerns me is that you spent an hour on a text that earned you two euros fifty (2.50) gross, or should that be twenty-five euros?
(Edited to change devis to quotes.)
[Edited at 2010-05-10 15:58 GMT]
| | | | Laurent KRAULAND (X)
France
Local time: 05:25
French to German
+ ...
| *Reading* a Code of Ethics??? | May 10, 2010 |
Natalia Manfredi wrote:
Some people have never read a Code of Ethics... What can we do about it? I agree with Fiona: "Pay peanuts, get monkeys".
That is, in the rare cases they are likely (to want) to know that such Codes exist...
| | | | Andrea Riffo
Chile
Local time: 23:25
English to Spanish
+ ...
| If only it were that simple... | May 10, 2010 |
Fiona Peterson wrote:
There is a saying that goes "Pay peanuts, get monkeys." I think that sums up this situation pretty well.
A little off-topic, but...
I wish it were as cut-and-dry as this. If it were, those who work for peanuts would do little to no real harm to our profession.
Unfortunately, much as I'd like to say it's either black or white, I've no doubt that some people offering ridiculously low rates actually do a decent job -and some, even a good one!-, and it is them who harm our market and take us steps back in our permanent struggle for decent rates.
Greetings
Andrea
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Arianne Farah
Canada
Local time: 23:25
Member (2008)
English to French
| Better free than cheap... | May 11, 2010 |
If this is the only way you can get experience then I say better free than bottom of the barrel cheap.
In my opinion offering translation services for free is like interning - you offer your time for free in exchange for a glimpse of the real market and for feedback and mentoring - you are outside the pay scale and your work is not held up to the same standard since as part of the social contract the people you work for are supposed to help better your work. Of course this is in a p... See more If this is the only way you can get experience then I say better free than bottom of the barrel cheap.
In my opinion offering translation services for free is like interning - you offer your time for free in exchange for a glimpse of the real market and for feedback and mentoring - you are outside the pay scale and your work is not held up to the same standard since as part of the social contract the people you work for are supposed to help better your work. Of course this is in a perfect world but still.
However if you turn around and offer the same services for 0.01$/word you are suddenly competing on the market with other translators - your work becomes a deliverable and in this case the better you are at what you do, the more damage you cause to your future profession by working at cut-throat rates.
Perhaps another solution would be an in-house position for 6 months or 1 year - the pay is usually not stellar but you'll get the same advantages mentioned up above for interning as well as experience to spring off of when you do go freelance. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Lucas Rayel
Brazil
Local time: 00:25
English to Portuguese
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That's all I have to say: WOW!
| | | | Erkan Dogan
United States
Local time: 22:25
English to Turkish
+ ...
| Is it really bad? | May 11, 2010 |
Sandra Petch wrote:
I was surprised to read this on a profile on ProZ today:
"I am keen to undertake translation work and, due to the fact that I have just registered on this database, I am willing to provide my services at a cheaper rate or even free of charge!!!"
We all had to begin somewhere, and undercutting rates has been widely discussed here. But now we have "colleagues" offering to work for free!
How do others react when they read this?
I don't think anyone likes reading sth like this on ProZ. ProZ is a professional marketplace and we all want to see professionals. However, I wouldn't mind seeing such a "generous" offer. When I look from a customer's perspective, I would probably ask the question of "who would offer his/her service for free or almost for nothing". If my business is important - and I am telling you it is - I would not buy it.
As I said, this is a place for professionals and offering services for free on such a platform is NOT professional at all. Therefore, I think we should stop comparing ourselves to full-time pro-bono workers As someone earlier said, "pay peanuts, get monkeys". I don't think I would be convinced by being paid with peanuts There is obviously a class difference between you and that person. I wouldn't get stuck on it.
Best,
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