| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5] > | Job posting: "Looking for honest translators..." Thread poster: Claudia Krysztofiak
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Aurora Humarán (X) 
Argentina
Local time: 22:55
English to Spanish
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Ramon Inglada wrote:
This is only my humble opinion, but I'd say that the job poster was well aware of that.
Of course that she is aware. She is perfectly aware of what she is proposing.
When such a job offer is posted, the outsourcer shouldn't get any answer in reply to the unacceptable conditions suggested.
Shouldn't but they do get answers and they will get more if we don't share the information we have with other people who are: either junior or less aware of our customary rules (weekends should have a surcharge, for example.)
(who decides what is acceptable and what is not? What is acceptable for one person might definitely not be so for another one, and so on).
Working during a weekend is the same everywhere. A super rush job is the same everywhere.
As far as warning junior colleagues, as myself, I'd like to say that I'm sincerely grateful for you efforts, but many of us are too well aware of this situation (and I'd dare to say this is true particularly in the English-Spanish combination).
Let me tell you what I know about this. A couple of years ago, I organized a survey. For that I contacted Henry, and the site owners of the other three important sites for translators. I contacted translators via ProZ.com, via those sites and via the many lists I am a member of.
Now... these people are already in a group that knows about translation sites, so they don't count so much for this analysis.
I was invited to run a workshop on international markets, once in Rosario and once in Buenos Aires. I was full of information that I wanted to share with fellow colleagues. The first workshop placed me in front of +100 translators. How many have heard about ProZ.com? 3. After that I have lectured a couple of times and I have always been surprised by the same thing: not everybody has ProZ.com as the home page! They don't even know it! or the many translators lists that exist!
Last month, I visited some of the most important universities in my country to talk about the conference I was organizing.
I talked about all the speakers and the conference in general, but I ended up talking about ProZ.com. How many knew ProZ.com? In a group of 50 students from the 4th year of Translation Studies: 1 (one).
When I was putting on my coat and putting my things away to leave, some students asked the professor if they could ask me more things. We left the classroom together, one of the questions they asked me:
Do you really work as a translator?
Ramón, do you think that these junior people (who will graduate very soon) have the faintest idea that a PDF should be charged more than a Word file, or that we should apply a surcharge if we are asked to work during weekends?
They don't. If they start accepting abussive proposals, this will start affecting eveybody's market. Domino effect. In the middle run, not only the Eng>Spa community, I am sure.
The Argentine English > Spanish community is HUGE. Do you know how many certified translators has the Colegio de Traductores Públicos de Buenos Aires (one of the many associations we have)? 5,800. I repeat: one of the many associations we have. Besides, I am only mentioning legal translators.
I insist: information is KEY in life. In the life of a translator it is KEYer. (linguistic joke)
Big kiss from cloudy Buenos Aires.
 Au
[Edited at 2006-09-13 12:24]
| | | | | Internationally changing rates | Sep 13, 2006 |
I'm particularly fond of the stipulation that for American translators, the rate will be the same, but in USD. Um... Is it that my work is simply inferior to that of European translators? (Quantifiably inferior at that- and variable according to the current exchange rate.) What about American translators living abroad? Or non-American translators living in the US? What about dual citizenship?
That means that I'm worth (today) only 78% of my European colleagues. Maybe it's payb... See more I'm particularly fond of the stipulation that for American translators, the rate will be the same, but in USD. Um... Is it that my work is simply inferior to that of European translators? (Quantifiably inferior at that- and variable according to the current exchange rate.) What about American translators living abroad? Or non-American translators living in the US? What about dual citizenship?
That means that I'm worth (today) only 78% of my European colleagues. Maybe it's payback from pre-Euro days when I might have been worth 2000% of my Italian colleagues.
Anna ▲ Collapse
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Aurora Humarán wrote:
... weekends should have a surcharge, for example...
I agree.
I insist: information is KEY in life. In the life of a translator it is KEYer. (linguistic joke)
I agree.
Have you covered this topic (weekend work, for example) in any of your knowledgebase articles? If we have the right articles in place, we can reference them among each other when job postings such as this appear.
| | | | Maria Gustafson
United States
Local time: 20:55
Member (2005)
Spanish to English
+ ...
| I didn't mean to offend anybody | Sep 13, 2006 |
I am just looking for translators who work the same way I do.
Thank you
Maria Gustafson
Claudia Krysztofiak wrote: Now that job description really was fun to look at. They want honest translators, which are people who: can work on weekends if necessary, those that can prove experience, those who can accept low rates due to huge volume, reliable, responsible, accurate, those who can comply with deadlines without complaining, those who can translate, proofread and edit a job if necessary. There was no volume given as far as I have seen, but a low rate nevertheless. And payment after 60 days. It seems this agency may has had some bad experiences with translators. I just wonder why, honestly ... [Subject edited by staff or moderator 2006-09-13 09:41]
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Maria Gustafson
United States
Local time: 20:55
Member (2005)
Spanish to English
+ ...
| No you are not inferior | Sep 13, 2006 |
It's that clients in the US pay in American Dollars, while Europeans pay in Euros. That's it.
Maria Gustafson
Anna Strowe wrote:
I'm particularly fond of the stipulation that for American translators, the rate will be the same, but in USD. Um... Is it that my work is simply inferior to that of European translators? (Quantifiably inferior at that- and variable according to the current exchange rate.) What about American translators living abroad? Or non-American translators living in the US? What about dual citizenship?
That means that I'm worth (today) only 78% of my European colleagues. Maybe it's payback from pre-Euro days when I might have been worth 2000% of my Italian colleagues.
Anna
| | | | Maria Gustafson
United States
Local time: 20:55
Member (2005)
Spanish to English
+ ...
| I have worked on weekend due to deadlines | Sep 13, 2006 |
I've just mentioned that because I had sometimes worked on weekends due to very tight deadlines.
Maria Gustafson
Henry wrote: Aurora Humarán wrote:
... weekends should have a surcharge, for example... I agree. I insist: information is KEY in life. In the life of a translator it is KEYer. (linguistic joke) I agree. Have you covered this topic (weekend work, for example) in any of your knowledgebase articles? If we have the right articles in place, we can reference them among each other when job postings such as this appear.
| | | | Aurora Humarán (X)
Argentina
Local time: 22:55
English to Spanish
+ ...
| Maria Gustafson
United States
Local time: 20:55
Member (2005)
Spanish to English
+ ...
| I didn't mean to offend anybody by stating Honest Translators | Sep 13, 2006 |
I've been a translator for 27 years and sometimes, I get information from translators who are not really translators, I mean, they are very skilled people who know two or more languages but they have not been trained as translators.
I was just looking for translators who are willing to work the same way I do.
I apologize if I caused any inconvenience. I didn't mean to cause any kind of trouble.
Thank you
Maria Gustafson
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Rosa Maria Duenas Rios (X)
Local time: 21:55
| With all due respect... | Sep 13, 2006 |
MARIA GUSTAFSON wrote:
I did'nt mean to offend anybody
I am just looking for translators who work the same way I do.
Thank you
Maria Gustafson
MARIA GUSTAFSON wrote:
I've been a translator for 27 years and sometimes, /quote]
Thank you for your apology Maria (if the above is one), but it does not sound genuine to me... I find the first statement hard to believe from someone who says has been in the industry for 27 years. After 27 years you still do'nt know that rush jobs or week-end jobs have a surcharge?
MARIA GUSTAFSON wrote:
No you are not inferior
It's that clients in the US pay in American Dollars, while Europeans pay in Euros. That's it.
Maria Gustafson
What is the meaning of the above? That you cannot make the calculation of euros into dollars?
[Edited at 2006-09-14 13:48] to change my choice of words
[Edited at 2006-09-14 13:51]
| | | | | Translators who are not really translators??? | Sep 13, 2006 |
Once again an interesting choice of words. I've never trained as a translator and yet I've been doing it full time for years now. How is that dishonest beats me.
And you know what? I'm too busy translating to go out and get a peace of paper that will make me an 'honest' translator. Surely, repeat custom from my clients speaks for itself.
If you wanted qualified translators all you had to do is state so in the job post. That way nobody would've gotten offended.
Fo... See more Once again an interesting choice of words. I've never trained as a translator and yet I've been doing it full time for years now. How is that dishonest beats me.
And you know what? I'm too busy translating to go out and get a peace of paper that will make me an 'honest' translator. Surely, repeat custom from my clients speaks for itself.
If you wanted qualified translators all you had to do is state so in the job post. That way nobody would've gotten offended.
Food for thought.
Branka
MARIA GUSTAFSON wrote:
I've been a translator for 27 years and sometimes, I get information from translators who are not really translators, I mean, they are very skilled people who know two or more languages but they have not been trained as translators.
I was just looking for translators who are willing to work the same way I do.
I apologize if I caused any inconvenience. I didn't mean to cause any kind of trouble.
Thank you
Maria Gustafson ▲ Collapse
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Oh boy, are we going to have our first translator 1-on-1? Rumble in the literary jungle? Eye of the tiger and all that?
I don't really get the discussion,...
Accepting a degrading offer should be anyone's free choice and as far as the world we are living in is concerned, it is.
For some translators this might be due to a short of cash, for others it might be a question of thinking "maybe more work can come from this and next time I can jack up my prices a bit".
... See more Oh boy, are we going to have our first translator 1-on-1? Rumble in the literary jungle? Eye of the tiger and all that?
I don't really get the discussion,...
Accepting a degrading offer should be anyone's free choice and as far as the world we are living in is concerned, it is.
For some translators this might be due to a short of cash, for others it might be a question of thinking "maybe more work can come from this and next time I can jack up my prices a bit".
From my point of view :
In Belgium all of the airline companies suffer from RyanAir.
Why?
Same service (basic version) - Lower prices
In Italy the people working on the vinyards will 9/10 be Pakistani / Indian / Polish.
Why?
Same service (the Italians no longer want to work for these prices) - Lower prices
I agree that people from the same profession need to stick together (somewhat) and I agree we can't / won't all start working for $0.001 per translation, but I think it's useless getting worked up about.
I'm wondering if anyone who reacted fiercely to the offer would for example reject a brand new all-inclusive laptop (the only thing this thing does not have is the fancy brand name) for 20$, knowing that it was produced in China (let's face it, people on assembly lines there work for less money) and knowing that you are actually hurting a better known company buying from someone else...
In my job we make offers to hotels, and sometimes hotel managers will laugh in our face, and sometimes they will say "just for this once" and sometimes they say "yeah sure" and we end up working with them for the same prices for 5 years...and STILL we are not the best in Italy...meaning that others, like us, are getting even better deals...
Do I need to start feeling bad? Don't hold your breath, everyone... ▲ Collapse
| | | | Rosa Maria Duenas Rios (X)
Local time: 21:55
| No rounds, please; you seem to miss the point (or the question is not the price) | Sep 13, 2006 |
Hello Dimitri,
I think that what the majority of us are asking for is that, if Proz.com is a site for "language professionals" (please read at the top of the home page), care be taken so that its contents also look professional.
An offer searching for "honest translators" where "honest" implies low rates, willingness to work on week-ends without charging extra, and not complaining about anything, among other questionable requests, seems to me very unprofessional.
... See more Hello Dimitri,
I think that what the majority of us are asking for is that, if Proz.com is a site for "language professionals" (please read at the top of the home page), care be taken so that its contents also look professional.
An offer searching for "honest translators" where "honest" implies low rates, willingness to work on week-ends without charging extra, and not complaining about anything, among other questionable requests, seems to me very unprofessional.
On your example about being tempted with low prices, I will give you my own example: I was born in Mexico; and I do seek to buy Mexican coffee (preferably organic and fair traded), rather than imported one, even if the price is higher. I also avoid very well known foreign coffee chains.
You might call it a grain on salt in the desert, but I know I am not the only one to do this, and I do believe that if I (we)keep buying coffee from Mexican producers, their livelihoods might improve. ▲ Collapse
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| Do weekend jobs have a surcharge? | Sep 13, 2006 |
Rosa Maria Duenas Rios wrote:
After 27 years you still do'nt know that rush jobs or week-end jobs have a surcharge?
This sounds kind of a condemnation to me.
Well, this is not mandatory. Just one way to raise the income.
Lately there was a great market survey on the income of translators accomplished by the German translators association ADÜ Nord.
819 translators (among which 563 living in Germany, 42 in the USA, 28 Italy) completed the elaborate questionnaire.
Among the 35 questions about the income were:
"Do you charge an extra weekend-fee?"
52% : Yes
The other 48% are NOT just beginners or clueless old-timers.
Regards
Steffi
[Edited at 2006-09-13 17:11]
| | | | | Fortunately.. | Sep 13, 2006 |
.. it was not the job "Translation of a code of ethics"
| | | | Rosa Maria Duenas Rios (X)
Local time: 21:55
| It is not a condemnation at all | Sep 13, 2006 |
Tuliparola wrote: Rosa Maria Duenas Rios wrote:
After 27 years you still do'nt know that rush jobs or week-end jobs have a surcharge?
This sounds kind of a condemnation to me. Well, this is not mandatory. Just one way to raise the income. Lately there was a great market survey on the income of translators accomplished by the German translators association ADÜ Nord. 819 translators (among which 563 living in Germany, 42 in the USA, 28 Italy) completed the elaborate questionnaire. Among the 35 questions about the income were: "Do you charge an extra weekend-fee?" 52% : Yes The other 48% are NOT just beginners or clueless old-timers. Regards Steffi [Edited at 2006-09-13 17:11]
I hope you were able to read the original ad, Tuliparola.
I know that surcharges are not mandatory, and that there are translators who do not apply them. It just surprises me that a person who has been in the translation profession for 27 years will choose to ignore, in the way she drafted her ad, that at least 50% of translators (according to your survey; I believe the percentage is higher in the US where the outsourcer lives) add a surcharge for week-end work.
[Edited at 2006-09-13 17:31]
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