Pages in topic:   < [1 2]
Kudoz - should be for full sentences, too, and generally more serious
Thread poster: Astrid Elke Witte
Tatjana Aleksic, MA (X)
Tatjana Aleksic, MA (X)  Identity Verified
English to Serbo-Croat
+ ...
Aug 7, 2001

Something should be done about KudoZ grading system. Nobody can prohibit members from answering questions, even giving wrong answers, but answerers are sometimes not aware of the quality of the answer they are awarding points to. There is also the problem of answering questions in one\'s non-native tongue(s). Recently, I have disagreed with a colleague about the poor grammar in her answer to a question posted in Serbian/English pair. Quote:\"I still don\'t understand where did you find that I ne... See more
Something should be done about KudoZ grading system. Nobody can prohibit members from answering questions, even giving wrong answers, but answerers are sometimes not aware of the quality of the answer they are awarding points to. There is also the problem of answering questions in one\'s non-native tongue(s). Recently, I have disagreed with a colleague about the poor grammar in her answer to a question posted in Serbian/English pair. Quote:\"I still don\'t understand where did you find that I needed advice\". I commented on her error in leaving inversion in a Reported Question, only to get sniggered at by her and another member, who \"knowingly\" said that I didn\'t know the difference between Reported Speech and Sequence of Tenses! I even received threats that I would \"bear the consequences for such unprofessional remarks\"!!! Faced with ignorance of the basics of the language one claims to translate into, I would like to propose another forum, where true language professionals, trained in languages and/or native speakers of certain languages could trash out problems of this kind, and even give advice to translators who are experts in other fields (technical, for example), but do not have specialised language training.



There is also the problem of answering questions in an ubelievable number of language pairs. Troy once wrote in one forum that \"decent\" translators do not translate in a language that is not their mother tongue. While KudoZ can show some expertise, what do they show in members who answer questions in 10-15 pairs?
Collapse


 
Henry Dotterer
Henry Dotterer
Local time: 01:01
SITE FOUNDER
Aug 7, 2001

Quote:


On 2001-08-02 20:13, Bremer wrote:

I am a little disturbed about the fact that some professionals on this site seem to think that writing the exact same answer for a Kudoz question sounds different when it comes from them.




Be aware that in some cases when a suggested answer is repeated, it is because the latter person, in taking more time to answer, does not realize that the another p
... See more
Quote:


On 2001-08-02 20:13, Bremer wrote:

I am a little disturbed about the fact that some professionals on this site seem to think that writing the exact same answer for a Kudoz question sounds different when it comes from them.




Be aware that in some cases when a suggested answer is repeated, it is because the latter person, in taking more time to answer, does not realize that the another person has already suggested the same thing.
Collapse


 
Henry Dotterer
Henry Dotterer
Local time: 01:01
SITE FOUNDER
Aug 7, 2001

Quote:


There is also the problem of answering questions in an ubelievable number of language pairs. Troy once wrote in one forum that \"decent\" translators do not translate in a language that is not their mother tongue.





I think you may have misunderstood Troy. In fact, he has translated, when required, and also interprets into a second language. I believe his posting in this forum asked for opinions re... See more
Quote:


There is also the problem of answering questions in an ubelievable number of language pairs. Troy once wrote in one forum that \"decent\" translators do not translate in a language that is not their mother tongue.





I think you may have misunderstood Troy. In fact, he has translated, when required, and also interprets into a second language. I believe his posting in this forum asked for opinions related to the matter, and did not actually come down on either side of the debate. ▲ Collapse


 
AA1 (X)
AA1 (X)
German to English
Aug 8, 2001

Thank you Tatjana for your input.



I have seen a few instances of remarks being exchanged by \"KudoZians\" , but your experiences seem to be quite \"unique\".



I, too, have noticed this growing number of translators posting answers in \"millions\" of language combinations. However, sometimes their answers may prove to be helpful as well, so I would not discard them out of hand.



But Tat
... See more
Thank you Tatjana for your input.



I have seen a few instances of remarks being exchanged by \"KudoZians\" , but your experiences seem to be quite \"unique\".



I, too, have noticed this growing number of translators posting answers in \"millions\" of language combinations. However, sometimes their answers may prove to be helpful as well, so I would not discard them out of hand.



But Tatjana is absolutely correct in her observations concerning \"poor English\" and \"ignorance\". What concerns me is not KudoZians posting answers, but those among them that also claim to be able to actually translate into English on a professional level. I mean, with all due respect, how can you produce a good translation into English if you cannot even phrase a simple KudoZ answer??



But don\'t despair: the market (clients) will take care of that. After all, some of those clients may just look at the KudoZ answers given by a certain translator and then find out that he or she may not be the best choice for the job in question.



Another trend that I find troubling is the rising number of translators who state, as their ONLY qualification, \"Brainbench certification\". Brainbench is nothing but harmless fun, but it is not a real qualification. Brainbench is, in fact, a modern example of \"winning one\'s licence, etc. in the lottery\". I don\'t think that PROZ.COM should allow this sort of thing - it takes away from this website\'s credibility as well as of that of any member listed here.



P.S.: Feel free to use my coinage \"KudoZian\" - I have no intention of copyrighting it
Collapse


 
Parrot
Parrot  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 06:01
Spanish to English
+ ...
Aug 25, 2001

Right. So I\'m not the only one who feels that some questions are frivolous or totally off-track. I\'ve exchanged notes with Albert Golub on this (we get a lot of language students who don\'t want to open dictionaries, and as language and translation teachers as well, we feel we shouldn\'t encourage them). I go along to a certain extent, but when it\'s evident that they begin to use the site to get a free homework, it\'s a little insulting to the teacher in us.

 
Didier Fourcot
Didier Fourcot  Identity Verified
Local time: 06:01
Member (2004)
English to French
Aug 27, 2001

If your students found this site, then at least it shows that they are Internet-savvy enough and could become some day good translators.

The rule for homework has to be defined clearly: are you allowed to ask for help from your brother, sister, father...grandmother to do your homework?

If this is allowed and the use of dictionaries is not forbidden, then why not ask your neighbor, and through the Internet any user in the world is your neighbor?

Asking a question to
... See more
If your students found this site, then at least it shows that they are Internet-savvy enough and could become some day good translators.

The rule for homework has to be defined clearly: are you allowed to ask for help from your brother, sister, father...grandmother to do your homework?

If this is allowed and the use of dictionaries is not forbidden, then why not ask your neighbor, and through the Internet any user in the world is your neighbor?

Asking a question to somebody who knows the subject better than you do is also a good way of learning... you as a teacher have then to decide whether this deserves the same mark as a personal research.

If the same answer can be obtained by hours of search in a library and minutes of search on the Internet, I am not sure that the first method is worth a better grade
[addsig]
Collapse


 
Maya Jurt
Maya Jurt  Identity Verified
Switzerland
Local time: 06:01
French to German
+ ...
Sep 23, 2001

I am pretty new to the forum and have found little time to go through all the questions and advice. However, one topic struck me: Dave Simons posted a message on June 13, relating to points given to questions obviously wrong or not adequate. What can be done about it? I had that annoying experience several times, but why bother? If I really feel my answer or someone else\'s would make a difference, I send a mail to that person, pointing out why he should reexamine the question. Of course, no Kud... See more
I am pretty new to the forum and have found little time to go through all the questions and advice. However, one topic struck me: Dave Simons posted a message on June 13, relating to points given to questions obviously wrong or not adequate. What can be done about it? I had that annoying experience several times, but why bother? If I really feel my answer or someone else\'s would make a difference, I send a mail to that person, pointing out why he should reexamine the question. Of course, no Kudoz points, but that is not the point.

I did that recently pointing out the difference of God\' mercy and God\'s grace, since it was a religious question and correct translation seemed important in this case (like in all other cases, but it is not up to us to decide).



By the way, it took a few days to figure out who is genuinely helping, who runs after the points with dictionaries ready, who takes your answer and distributes the points to buddies. But that is the name of the game!
Collapse


 
Nikki Graham
Nikki Graham  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:01
Spanish to English
Sep 28, 2001

On the subject of points, I\'ve noticed that someone with a lot of points in my section recently posted a lot of questions, which are still ungraded (some of which I answered, some I graded, and some didn\'t have a clue so didn\'t bother). I must admit that it DOES bother me that there isn\'t even an \"answer selected - 0 points\" to these questions by someone who obviously knows how this system works. So, my suggestion is (radical, I know, but I spent a lot of my time answering/checking those q... See more
On the subject of points, I\'ve noticed that someone with a lot of points in my section recently posted a lot of questions, which are still ungraded (some of which I answered, some I graded, and some didn\'t have a clue so didn\'t bother). I must admit that it DOES bother me that there isn\'t even an \"answer selected - 0 points\" to these questions by someone who obviously knows how this system works. So, my suggestion is (radical, I know, but I spent a lot of my time answering/checking those questions and sometimes I wonder whether people don\'t give points because they don\'t want the competition - and I\'m not referring to myself, as my points cannot compare) that points be deducted if you do not grade your questions after a certain period (a month say - I\'ve often left a question open for quite a while, even after handing in the translation, in the hope that someone will give a better answer for future reference) to encourage people to be fair. After all, let\'s face it, the points are there for a reason and it\'s obvious that people want them, and there are other ways of getting answers to your questions (e.g. the translations lists I belong to) with no points involved at all. To be quite honest, I\'m stil trying to work out (being new to the site, and having observed other \"strange behaviour\") whether it\'s worth the effort or not, although I\'ve learnt a lot. Thank you to those concerned.Collapse


 
Nikki Graham
Nikki Graham  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:01
Spanish to English
Sep 28, 2001

On the subject of points, I\'ve noticed that someone with a lot of points in my section recently posted a lot of questions, which are still ungraded (some of which I answered, some I graded, and some didn\'t have a clue so didn\'t bother). I must admit that it DOES bother me that there isn\'t even an \"answer selected - 0 points\" to these questions by someone who obviously knows how this system works. So, my suggestion is (radical, I know, but I spent a lot of my time answering/checking those q... See more
On the subject of points, I\'ve noticed that someone with a lot of points in my section recently posted a lot of questions, which are still ungraded (some of which I answered, some I graded, and some didn\'t have a clue so didn\'t bother). I must admit that it DOES bother me that there isn\'t even an \"answer selected - 0 points\" to these questions by someone who obviously knows how this system works. So, my suggestion is (radical, I know, but I spent a lot of my time answering/checking those questions and sometimes I wonder whether people don\'t give points because they don\'t want the competition - and I\'m not referring to myself, as my points cannot compare) that points be deducted if you do not grade your questions after a certain period (a month say - I\'ve often left a question open for quite a while, even after handing in the translation, in the hope that someone will give a better answer for future reference) to encourage people to be fair. After all, let\'s face it, the points are there for a reason and it\'s obvious that people want them, and there are other ways of getting answers to your questions (e.g. the translations lists I belong to) with no points involved at all. To be quite honest, I\'m stil trying to work out (being new to the site, and having observed other \"strange behaviour\") whether it\'s worth the effort or not, although I\'ve learnt a lot. Thank you to those concerned.



PS sorry if this gets posted twice, I lost my connection just as I hit the submit button



Nikki Graham
Collapse


 
shasas
shasas  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 06:01
English to German
Copycats Oct 10, 2001

Quote:


On 2001-08-07 23:07, Henry wrote:

Quote:


On 2001-08-02 20:13, Bremer wrote:

I am a little disturbed about the fact that some professionals on this site seem to think that writing the exact same answer for a Kudoz question sounds different when it comes from them.




Be aware that in some cases when a suggested answer is rep... See more
Quote:


On 2001-08-07 23:07, Henry wrote:

Quote:


On 2001-08-02 20:13, Bremer wrote:

I am a little disturbed about the fact that some professionals on this site seem to think that writing the exact same answer for a Kudoz question sounds different when it comes from them.




Be aware that in some cases when a suggested answer is repeated, it is because the latter person, in taking more time to answer, does not realize that the another person has already suggested the same thing.









Yes, such things happen. But I noticed quite some \"new\" answers that were actually based on a prevoius answer and just rephrased what had been said. I guess a remark in the peer grade option would have done the trick, but, obviously, KudoZ points are too valuable to some to compete in a fair manner.



Let\'s face it, the way the system works, it =is= competitive. That\'s the nature of anything that comes along with high score lists. As a veteran PC gamer, I don\'t have any problems with it I just don\'t like obvious copycats.



Collapse


 
Leonardo Faria
Leonardo Faria  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 01:01
English to Portuguese
+ ...
Disagree Oct 7, 2019

I disagree with you, posting whole sentences is a lot useful, if we get stuck to words, we became an species of "translator google". And love letters and hashish recipes are not frivolous, that's a kind of prejudice coming from you, I think.

See you soon!


 
Pages in topic:   < [1 2]


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:


You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

Kudoz - should be for full sentences, too, and generally more serious






Trados Studio 2022 Freelance
The leading translation software used by over 270,000 translators.

Designed with your feedback in mind, Trados Studio 2022 delivers an unrivalled, powerful desktop and cloud solution, empowering you to work in the most efficient and cost-effective way.

More info »
CafeTran Espresso
You've never met a CAT tool this clever!

Translate faster & easier, using a sophisticated CAT tool built by a translator / developer. Accept jobs from clients who use Trados, MemoQ, Wordfast & major CAT tools. Download and start using CafeTran Espresso -- for free

Buy now! »