Poll: Has your source language influenced your target language's grammar, syntax, vocabulary, etc.? Thread poster: ProZ.com Staff
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This forum topic is for the discussion of the poll question "Has your source language influenced your target language's grammar, syntax, vocabulary, etc.?".
This poll was originally submitted by Natalia Pedrosa. View the poll results »
| | | | neilmac
Spain
Local time: 01:53
Spanish to English
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As I've lived in my source language country (Spain) for over two decades, some of it has definitely rubbed off on my language use in the personal sphere, but I'd say that it only has a very slight effect on my translation work, perhaps making me better predisposed towards literal translation or calques than I might otherwise be. I like to think of it as mutual enrichment.
[Edited at 2016-11-28 08:57 GMT]
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Today, Danes love to complain about things going the other way, and perhaps some of them should take more care of their own language. It would in fact make life easier for translators if they spoke good Danish instead of a sloppy Danglish... Other modern expressions have been adopted because, if you are going to have to find a word, you might as well use the one everyone else understands. So a computer is a computer, and so on.
But when the Vikings came over the North Sea and set up... See more Today, Danes love to complain about things going the other way, and perhaps some of them should take more care of their own language. It would in fact make life easier for translators if they spoke good Danish instead of a sloppy Danglish... Other modern expressions have been adopted because, if you are going to have to find a word, you might as well use the one everyone else understands. So a computer is a computer, and so on.
But when the Vikings came over the North Sea and set up the Danelaw, they really made their mark on the language. It is even stronger in some of the northern dialects.
What a brilliant idea for a poll - I'm really looking forward to seeing what others have to say! ▲ Collapse
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I have four source languages (English, French, Spanish and Italian). Over the 30 years I lived in Belgium, French influenced for sure my oral language as I was daily exposed to the language and from time to time (mainly when I was extremely tired), I found myself saying odd things in Portuguese. I didn’t get a French accent in Portuguese but some of my relatives “accused” me of having a French intonation. On the other side, regarding translation work, all that made me extremely attentive t... See more I have four source languages (English, French, Spanish and Italian). Over the 30 years I lived in Belgium, French influenced for sure my oral language as I was daily exposed to the language and from time to time (mainly when I was extremely tired), I found myself saying odd things in Portuguese. I didn’t get a French accent in Portuguese but some of my relatives “accused” me of having a French intonation. On the other side, regarding translation work, all that made me extremely attentive to any foreign intrusions into grammar, syntax, vocabulary, etc… ▲ Collapse
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Helen Hagon 
Local time: 00:53
Member (2011)
Russian to English
+ ...
| In which sense? | Nov 28, 2016 |
Does this question refer to me personally, and whether my knowledge of other languages has affected the way I speak my native language? If so, I'm not sure that it has, except that I'm more aware of grammar and etymology than I would have been if I hadn't studied other languages.
Or, does it refer to the languages of the world in general? In that case, Russian hasn't had an enormous impact on the English language in history, but my other source language - French - most certainly has, along... See more Does this question refer to me personally, and whether my knowledge of other languages has affected the way I speak my native language? If so, I'm not sure that it has, except that I'm more aware of grammar and etymology than I would have been if I hadn't studied other languages.
Or, does it refer to the languages of the world in general? In that case, Russian hasn't had an enormous impact on the English language in history, but my other source language - French - most certainly has, along with Latin, German, Dutch, and the Scandinavian languages spoken by our many invaders over the centuries.
[Edited at 2016-11-28 10:17 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Julian Holmes
Japan
Local time: 08:53
Member (2011)
Japanese to English
| I certainly hope not | Nov 28, 2016 |
Japanese omits subjects and objects, too, sometimes. Sentences are often left open-ended and unfinished in conversation. Without counters, it's difficult to guess whether something is singular or plural. As a result, Japanese relies very heavily on context. And, none of these really applies to English.
Consequently, I really can't imagine any other language that is so completely different from English.
If this sentence were made to conform to Japanese syntax, it would b... See more Japanese omits subjects and objects, too, sometimes. Sentences are often left open-ended and unfinished in conversation. Without counters, it's difficult to guess whether something is singular or plural. As a result, Japanese relies very heavily on context. And, none of these really applies to English.
Consequently, I really can't imagine any other language that is so completely different from English.
If this sentence were made to conform to Japanese syntax, it would be something like this:
Consequently, [I] English from completely different that any other language really imagine can't.
Small edit
[Edited at 2016-11-29 07:44 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Ricki Farn
Germany
Local time: 01:53
English to German
| Import/export | Nov 28, 2016 |
I do that for fun - I tell English speakers that someone is as intelligent as three meters of dirt road and has the self-organizational skills of a medium-sized earthworm (my little brother's use of German) or tell Germans that someone has bitten off more than they can chew (we don't say that in German but we should). Oh and the verb "to lizard" for "lying in the sun doing precisely nothing" is from French but should go viral world-wide.
I like to think that I don't do it outside of... See more I do that for fun - I tell English speakers that someone is as intelligent as three meters of dirt road and has the self-organizational skills of a medium-sized earthworm (my little brother's use of German) or tell Germans that someone has bitten off more than they can chew (we don't say that in German but we should). Oh and the verb "to lizard" for "lying in the sun doing precisely nothing" is from French but should go viral world-wide.
I like to think that I don't do it outside of conscious import/export, but who knows.
What has influenced my verbal language is the stilted written-only expressions I need for certain translations. They're just top of mind by now. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Yes, but I hope not more than it already had | Nov 28, 2016 |
Julian Holmes wrote:
Japanese omits subjects and objects, too, sometimes. Sentences are often left open-ended and unfinished in conversation. Without counters, it's difficult to guess whether something is singular or plural. As a result, Japanese relies very heavily on context. And, none of these really applies to English.
Consequently, I really can't imagine any other language that is so completely different from English.
If this sentence were made to conform to Japanese syntax, it would be something like this:
Consequently, [I] English from completely different that any other language really imagine can't.
I agree with Julian, especially because I work in this pair as well.
I can't say one of my languages hasn't influenced another, but it definitely helped me to grow as a professional. My first pair was English-Russian, and they can easily have similar word order, despite all their differences, so it is really tempting to keep the word order while translating. It's easy, it seems to work... and it is a mistake, especially common among beginners. It is feasible sometimes, but even though we have two SVOs, Russian can allow almost any word order, because it is not the thing that specifies relations between words in it.
Japanese is different from both, because it's an SOV language. Julian provided a good example of a Japanese syntax. When you come across something like this, you absolutely must do grammatical transformations. So when I started to pay more attention to Japanese and introduce it into my work, I've noticed that I became more confident with altering the word order in En-Ru pair. I was really lucky to have this experience in the very beginning of my professional career, but this is one of the few possible examples of interlingual influence for translators.
(made small corrections)
[Edited at 2016-11-28 20:52 GMT]
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Mario Freitas
Brazil
Local time: 20:53
Member (2014)
English to Portuguese
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In Brazil, we learn our very tough grammar from 4th to 12th grade, and still very few people are able to write well in Portuguese. So, when it came to English grammar, only taught in 7th and 8th grades, I already had over three years of pretty harsh grammar studying, and grammar in English was a straight A+ subject for me. Of course the grammar of my source language influenced my target language grammar, but in a very positive way.
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Not grammar or syntax, but I mainly translate medical texts and a huge proportion of English medical terminology is just Greek transliterated into the Latin alphabet.
| | | | Georgia Morg (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 00:53
Portuguese to English
Since I am often asked if I am "really" English, I guess it has! I know I often omit auxiliary verbs in questions and employ a rising intonation instead (eg, "Did you go?" becomes "you went?")
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With my background in linguistics, I am keenly sensitive to syntactic and stylistic differences and I bend over backwards to stay faithful to my target language, which is my mother tongue. I am constantly checking my phraseology on Google to make sure it's commonly used.
There may be a carryover in my spoken language, but that doesn't worry me. I certainly carry Portuguese over to Spanish. When Spanish speakers stare at me blankly, not having understood what I said, I know that I ha... See more With my background in linguistics, I am keenly sensitive to syntactic and stylistic differences and I bend over backwards to stay faithful to my target language, which is my mother tongue. I am constantly checking my phraseology on Google to make sure it's commonly used.
There may be a carryover in my spoken language, but that doesn't worry me. I certainly carry Portuguese over to Spanish. When Spanish speakers stare at me blankly, not having understood what I said, I know that I have slipped into Portuguese. (On the other hand, I'm very careful to make sure that Spanish doesn't influence my Portuguese.)
[Edited at 2016-11-29 11:42 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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