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sous-jacents
Vieillissement du matériel
Oct 25, 2018 11:21
5 yrs ago
1 viewer *
French term

thiodène

French to English Science Chemistry; Chem Sci/Eng Lab analysis techniques
I know what this is — and it is being used as a 'marker' for the end of a reaction involving iodine.

But I have not found the equivalent in EN.
Termium gives 'Vitex', which I think is a proprietary name, but seems only common in CA or other francophone areas.
I have found 'Iodex', which likewise seems to be a proprietary name, but does at least seem to be used in EN.

I would be very grateful if anyone could confirm if this is just a different name for essentially the same product — or if it is maybe used for equivalent purposes, but not actually the same product?

It only appears once, after a discussion about how to determine when the reaction is complete:

"(le thiodène est également utilisé comme marqueur de fin de réaction)"

If any of you out there are chemists and prepared to help me with further queries, which are a bit too long for KudoZ, I'd be most grateful if I might contact you privately, please?

Thanks in advance!
Proposed translations (English)
4 +3 thyodene
4 thiodene
3 thiocétone (thione)
References
Thyodene
Change log

Oct 25, 2018 12:34: writeaway changed "Language pair" from "English to French" to "French to English"

Votes to reclassify question as PRO/non-PRO:

Non-PRO (2): GILLES MEUNIER, Rachel Fell

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Discussion

Charles Davis Oct 25, 2018:
@Johannes Thank you! My knowledge of chemistry is by no means profound. I was simply reporting what the company that owns the trademark says about this product on its material data safety sheet, and also making the point that a trademark is a trademark and should not be modified or "translated".
Johannes Gleim Oct 25, 2018:
Continued Maltooligosaccharide
Bezeichnung für die O-α(1→4)-d-Glucose-Oligomere mit 3 bis 20 Glucose-Einheiten, welche durch unvollständige Hydrolyse von Amylose, Stärke, Glycogen mit Säuren oder mit Endoamylasen (α-Amylasen) entstehen (Zahl der Glucose-Einheiten: 3 = Maltotriose, 4 = Maltotetraose, 5 = Maltopentaose etc.). Vorkommen als Bestandteil des Stärke- bzw. Maltosesirups, der Bierwürze und im Bier.
:
Übersetzungen:
E maltooligosaccharides
F maltooligosaccharides
I maltooligosaccaridi
S maltooligosacáridos
https://roempp.thieme.de/roempp4.0/do/data/RD-13-00376

You may not being able to find the structural formula or additional text as this link requires a subscription (169 €/year).
Johannes Gleim Oct 25, 2018:
@ Charles Thank you for this suggestion. This explains the difficulties to find a generic name for this substance. As you may understand German or chemical formulas at least, I do add extracts from the Römpp:

Dextrine
Allgemein sind Dextrine chemisch oder enzymatisch erzeugte oligosaccharidische Depolymerisationsprodukte von Polysacchariden. Es sind lineare, verzweigte und cyclische Dextrine (cyclische Glycane) bekannt. Der Name „Dextrin“ steht jedoch nicht als allgemeines Synonym für Oligosaccharide, sondern wird nach IUPAC-IUMB, Regel 2-Carb-37.4 als Trivialname nur im Zusammenhang mit Cyclodextrinen (cyclische Maltooligosaccharide) empfohlen.
:
Beispiele:
Maltodextrine: Zu Maltodextrinen siehe dort.
Amylodextrin: Amylodextrin ist ein Synonym für höhere Maltooligosaccharide.
:
CAS® RN:
9005-84-9 (Amylodextrin)
50814-47-6 (Chitodextrin)
9061-30-7 (Cellodextrin)
9004-53-9 (Dextrin GESTIS)
9050-36-6 (Maltodextrin)
9061-56-7 (Mannodextrin)
9063-64-3 (Xylodextrin)
Übersetzungen:
E dextrine
https://roempp.thieme.de/roempp4.0/do/data/RD-04-00906?updat...

(continued)
Tony M (asker) Oct 25, 2018:
@ Charles Thanks a lot! I should have stopped to think, my source text is riddle with errors, but it just never occurred to me to try variant spellings for this term :-)
Charles Davis Oct 25, 2018:
Hi Tony "Thiodène" is a monstrosity. It's a gallicised version of Thyodene, which is a trademark of Fisher Scientific of Fair Lawn, New Jersey. Its chemical name is amylodextrin.
https://fscimage.fishersci.com/msds/40192.htm

Proposed translations

+3
37 mins
Selected

thyodene

"Fisher Chemical T138500 Thyodene Indicator (500g) CAS 9005-84-9 ...
https://www.coleparmer.com/i/fisher-chemical...thyodene-indi...
Buy Fisher Chemical T138500 Thyodene Indicator (500g) CAS 9005-84-9 (Starch, Soluble) and more from our comprehensive selection of Thyodene Indicator."

"Thyodene™ (Starch SoluIODINE INDICATOR | - ChemicalBook
https://www.chemicalbook.com/ChemicalProductProperty_EN_CB57...

CAS No. Chemical Name: IODINE INDICATOR. Synonyms: THYODENE;IODINE INDICATOR. CBNumber: CB5757921. Molecular Formula: I2. Formula Weight: ...
Chemical.net. THYODENE STABLE INDICATOR
https://www.chemical.net › Laboratory Chemicals

Picture of THYODENE STABLE INDICATOR 500G. THYODENE STABLE INDICATOR 500G. Package or Unit Size: 500G. Container Type: Poly Bottle. Chemical.ble) Indicator, Fisher ... - Fisher Scientific
https://www.fishersci.com › ... › Glycosyl compounds › O-glycosyl compounds
104,80 US$ to 503,02 US$
Thyodene (Starch Soluble) Indicator, Fisher Chemical Glass Bottle; 100g Chemicals:Organic Compounds:Organic oxygen compounds:Organooxygen ..."

"IODINE INDICATOR | - ChemicalBook
https://www.chemicalbook.com/ChemicalProductProperty_EN_CB57...
CAS No. Chemical Name: IODINE INDICATOR. Synonyms: THYODENE;IODINE INDICATOR. CBNumber: CB5757921. Molecular Formula: I2. Formula Weight: ..."

"Chemical.net. THYODENE STABLE INDICATOR
https://www.chemical.net › Laboratory Chemicals
Picture of THYODENE STABLE INDICATOR 500G. THYODENE STABLE INDICATOR 500G. Package or Unit Size: 500G. Container Type: Poly Bottle. Chemical."
Note from asker:
Thanks so much, F-X! Whyevere didn't I think to try it with a 'y' — and it's quite likely to be a typo in my FR source text too :-(
Peer comment(s):
agree Kim Metzger : https://tinyurl.com/y6u2nwhd
1 hr
agree Charles Davis
4 hrs
agree Johannes Gleim : Charles convinced me.
5 hrs
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thanks a lot, F-X! Your lateral thinking saved the day!"
2 hrs

thiodene

Other traces:

The name "Vitex" is strange, as it refers to a tree.

Vitex agnus-castus, also called vitex, chaste tree (or chastetree), chasteberry, Abraham's balm,[1] lilac chastetree,[2] or monk's pepper, is a native of the Mediterranean region. It is one of the few temperate-zone species of Vitex, which is on the whole a genus of tropical and sub-tropical flowering plants
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitex_agnus-castus

"Iodex" is probably wrong, see:

Commonly used brand name(s)
In the U.S.
• Aplicare One Tincture Of Iodine
• Iodex
• Iodoflex
• Iodosorb
https://www.drugs.com/cons/iodex-topical.html

Uses for Iodine
Antisepsis
Prevention of infection in the management of minor, superficial skin wounds,a b c wet wounds, and wet ulcers;h i reduces microbial load in wound environment.h i
https://www.drugs.com/monograph/iodine.html

Iodex Ointment
GENERIC NAME(S): Povidone-Iodine
https://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-62282/iodex-topical/detai...

Iodex Balm – The power packed formula of 5 natural ingredients.
Iodex Balm is a power packed formula of 5 natural ingredients – Gandapuro Tel, Pudina ka Phool, Nilgiri Tel, Turpine ka Tel, & Lavanga ka Tel. These ingredients help provide a warm & soothing effect at the site of pain that helps reduce inflammation & relieves pain.
http://www.iodex.co.in/products/balm/

The search for "thiodène" leads to another substance:

Le thiodène est de l'empois d'amidon, mélangé à de l'urée. Généralement, il est utilisé en fin de titrage pour mettre en évidence l'apparition ou la disparition complète du diiode. Si du diiode est présent dans la solution, le complexe amidon-diiode prend une teinte bleu foncé.
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thiodène
(not linked to any other page)

Définition de thiodène
nom masculin singulier
1. Chimie. Empois d'amidon dilué dans de l'urée, utilisé comme indicateur color
https://www.cordial.fr/dictionnaire/definition/thiodène.php

Le thiodène est de l'empois d'amidon, mélangé à de l'urée. On en ajoute une pointe de spatule à la fin d'un titrage pour mettre en évidence l'apparition du diiode. Il apparaîtra alors une couleur violet sombre en présence de diiode.
http://dictionnaire.sensagent.leparisien.fr/thiodene/fr-fr/

CAS 9005-84-9
PM 162.14
IOTEC est un nom de marque déposée dont la composition est tenue secrète par le fabricant. Il s’agit en majorité d’amidon rendu soluble par traitement approprié.
UTILISATION
Indicateur d’iode en iodométrie.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&c...

If only zinc chloride and starch (or thiodene indicator) are added to the test solution, a blue color indicates the presence of hypoiodite.
https://books.google.de/books?id=II06Q8GGqNUC&pg=PA150&lpg=P...

BTW, I wonder about, why the Römpp could not identify "thiodene".
Note from asker:
Well, as it turns out, it was a spelling mistake in the first palce. As for Vitex and Iodex, no, those are not errors, they came from my own lengthy research, and are indeed related products.
Thanks for your research, which pretty much duplicates what I had already found; the misledaing things was the anomalous spelling, which never led me to the EN version.
Something went wrong...
2 hrs
French term (edited): thioketone (thiodène)

thiocétone (thione)

downgraded my first entry, as I am not as sure as before that we deal with thione. Please find the text below for reference. It is up to you to check, whether it still fits your context or whether it was wrong.

Excuse me for using the German standard lexicon for chemicals, the Römpp:

Ihre Suche nach thiodène lieferte keine Treffer; stattdessen wurde eine Suche nach Thione durchgeführt.
6 Ergebnisse
1. Thione
Andreas Schmidt letzte Aktualisierung: Dezember 2007
Synonym für Thioketone.…
https://roempp.thieme.de/roempp4.0/do/Search.do?queryString=...

(Thione). Gruppenbezeichnung für die den Ketonen analogen Verbindungen mit einer Thiocarbonyl-Gruppe, deren Benennung nach IUPAC-Regel R-5.6.2.2 mit dem Suffix ...thion oder bei Vorliegen funktioneller Gruppen höherer Priorität mit dem Präfix Thioxo... erfolgt; Beispiele: Cyclohexanthion und 4-Thioxocyclohexancarbonsäure. Die Benennung mit dem Präfix Thio... vor dem Trivialnamen des entsprechenden Ketons gemäß überholter IUPAC-Regel C-532.2, z. B. Thiobenzophenon (H5C6–CS–C6H5), ist veraltet.
:
Übersetzungen:
E thioketones
F thiocétones
I tiochetoni
S tiocetonas
https://roempp.thieme.de/roempp4.0/do/data/RD-20-01469

Le thiodène est de l'empois d'amidon, mélangé à de l'urée. Généralement, il est utilisé en fin de titrage pour mettre en évidence l'apparition ou la disparition complète du diiode. Si du diiode est présent dans la solution, le complexe amidon-diiode prend une teinte bleu foncé.
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thiodène
(not linked to any other page)

Une thiocétone, parfois aussi appelée thione, est un composé organosulfuré analogue des cétones. Elle contient ainsi un groupe fonctionnel thiocarbonyle -C(=S)- où l'atome de carbone est par ailleurs relié à deux groupes alkyles, contrairement aux thioaldéhydes ou le carbone est lié à au moins un atome d'hydrogène. Les thiocétones sont en général moins stable que les cétones.
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thiocétone

Thioketones (also known as thiones or thiocarbonyls) are organosulfur compounds related to conventional ketones. Instead of the formula R2C=O, thioketones have the formula R2C=S, which is reflected by the prefix "thio-" in the name of the functional group. Unhindered alkylthioketones typically tend to form polymers or rings.[1]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thioketone
Note from asker:
Danke, Johaennes! As I said, i know what it is, this is basic inorganic chemistry, it's a simple iodine indicator
Thanks for your research, but this is clearly nothing to do with the specifically iodine-related context I specified.
Something went wrong...

Reference comments

8 hrs
Reference:

Thyodene

with a capital T

Thyodene™ (Starch Soluble) Indicator, Fisher Chemical
A stable, soluble indicator for iodometry

https://www.fishersci.ca/shop/products/thyodene-starch-solub...
Note from asker:
Thanks, Rachel! It's certainly a specialist term in a specialist field, but once F-Xhad pointed out the spelling error in my source text, it all of course became clear. Sadly, none of my searches with the incorrect spelling led me to the correctly-spelled version.
Something went wrong...
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