| Stron w wątku: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7] > | WordFast kaput, and a warning to all Autor wątku: Catherine Bolton
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| Why no warning? | May 25, 2012 |
In many similar situations (e.g. when your Proz membership is about to expire!) you get emailed a warning in very ample time to enable you to renew. I can't understand why this isn't the case with Wordfast.
Personally I have looked and looked and looked for information in Wordfast as to when my licence expires, so that I don't get caught out by it suddenly locking up on me, but I can't find the information anywhere. Can someone tell me where it is?
| | | | | License Notification | May 25, 2012 |
Dear B D Finch,
B D Finch wrote:
I have read your reply and appreciate that you made an offer to extend Catherine's licence. However, the shutdown of Wordfast might have occurred on a Saturday or a Sunday, or at some other time when you were not available to help out.
Just for your information the Wordfast Support has 7-day availability, not only because I am on a different scheme of weekend, but also because even my colleagues living in the EU check their emails throughout the week.
B D Finch wrote:
That offer should also have been the immediate response to Catherine's first email to Wordfast.
I am not sure what the reply received by Catherine was. However, I am sure that it is our general policy - even Catherine stated that my colleagues tried to help her. Some clients get so nervous, failing to explain the most important point, that they have a deadline. If a client rather needs to renew within a month, why should we offer an extension, you know.
B D Finch wrote:
This still doesn't answer the point about Wordfast's failure to (a) automatically notify its users of any change of policy or procedure that might impact their use of the CAT tool; (b) give a few days' notice of shutdown or loss of functionality that will occur if a licence is not renewed, together with accurate information about the cost of renewal.
This is a very good point and your feedback is appreciated. For your information, the new public version published just a few days ago has this. You can download and install the latest version of Wordfast Classic available at: http://www.wordfast.net/index.php?whichpage=downloadpage
B D Finch wrote:
I think that you, personally, have always seemed to be really helpful to Wordfast users. I wish that was still the general ethos of the company; Yves' response indicates that it is not.
Sorry, I cannot agree on the use of the word "personally"; we do not represent ourselves. Even if it is really about "persons", we have learnt being so helpful and patient from Yves Champollion. You, old users, know that very well. Still, the relation between a company and users is that of "give and take"; so we should be understanding to each other, you know.
---
Best Regards,
Yasmin Moslem
Wordfast Support Team
www.wordfast.com | www.wordfast.net
[Edited at 2012-05-25 21:55 GMT]
| | | | Catherine Bolton 
Local time: 09:23
włoski > angielski
+ ...
NOWY TEMAT In Memoriam | Glad someone understands the issue here ... | May 25, 2012 |
B D Finch wrote:
However, the shutdown of Wordfast might have occurred on a Saturday or a Sunday, or at some other time when you were not available to help out. That offer should also have been the immediate response to Catherine's first email to Wordfast. This still doesn't answer the point about Wordfast's failure to (a) automatically notify its users of any change of policy or procedure that might impact their use of the CAT tool; (b) give a few days' notice of shutdown or loss of functionality that will occur if a licence is not renewed, together with accurate information about the cost of renewal.
I think that you, personally, have always seemed to be really helpful to Wordfast users. I wish that was still the general ethos of the company; Yves' response indicates that it is not.
[Edited at 2012-05-25 20:58 GMT]
FWIW, one of the responses I also had from support was:
"Yes, I agree with you users should be warned in advance when their
license is about to expire. This hasn't been possible to implement
before for technical reasons (many users in our database have e-mail
addresses that are no longer valid). With the new version of Wordfast
(6.03t), a warning will be issued one month before the license expires,
which means it will no longer come as a surprise."
So they knew it was a surprise. In a decade of being a WF user I've never been so disappointed ... and over something that communication on their part could have avoided.
Catherine
| | | | Natalie
Polska
Local time: 09:23
Członek ProZ.com
od 2002
angielski > rosyjski
+ ...
Moderator tego forum SITE LOCALIZER | Hello Catherine | May 25, 2012 |
Catherine Bolton wrote:
Fine, I go to the support site to regenerate a license as they suggest, and it says that my license expired in January 2012.
...My license runs out in January but you decide to pull the plug on me on a Friday night (4 months later) with no advance warning?
Do I take it correctly that you haven't used Wordfast since January? If it is so, you cannot blame anyone that you received no license expiration warning: such messages are sent at appropriate time when you use your software. In case the software is not used the license are not checked at the server and messages are not triggered.
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| the sinister plot to fool the profession | May 25, 2012 |
Hi Catherine,
1. I fail to see the point in the Microsoft parallel, since their licensing scheme is diametrically opposed to ours.
2. Yes, older implementations of WF had a loophole that gave the possibility (not the right) to keep working past three years of use. You used WF for 5 years. And that is perfectly fine with me. But that never implied a guarantee that WF would continue to work indefinitely.
= = = =
We can grant extensions, be... See more Hi Catherine,
1. I fail to see the point in the Microsoft parallel, since their licensing scheme is diametrically opposed to ours.
2. Yes, older implementations of WF had a loophole that gave the possibility (not the right) to keep working past three years of use. You used WF for 5 years. And that is perfectly fine with me. But that never implied a guarantee that WF would continue to work indefinitely.
= = = =
We can grant extensions, bend our own rules... up to certain point. Your initial post was inflamatory, proposing a crusade to "warn" the profession of Wordfast's plot to ensnare translators. So crusade to your content. Meanwhile, I am irritated. My right.
You had customer care before your initial post, and probably are getting some right now. Bystander B D Finch jumps in with the easy "this is poor customer care" remark. Sorry for the bystander, we do customer care even with flamers. Even on week-ends. And nope, JL01 is no employee (is that an insult?). WF people use their real names, and unlike me, are patient and nice even when the customer is publicly alleging their company is a sinister one.
- YC
Catherine Bolton wrote: Yves Champollion wrote: Hello Catherine, the license Agreement you confirmed that you entered into (EULA, http://www.wordfast.net/?go=agreement) states that licenses (right to use the software) are valid for three years from date of purchase. You stated that your license was expired. What then do you expect. Amazingly, you're complaining about a support message... that provides a workaround, tells you how to keep using WF without paying. What more could they say. You don't want that - I'm afraid there isn't much left to do. It's nothing about version, it's about licensing period. The EULA is upfront, legible, clear. If WF policies and support have been known for anything, that's leniency. We've helped out thousands of translators by extending licenses so they can complete a job before opting to renew - we're translators ourselves. There's a limit to what we can do. If you stonewall any offer (free or paying) to solve the issue, I don't see what more we could do. Respectfully yours, Yves Champollion Yves, I was probably one of your first WF users and have always praised your program to all. When the license ran out, the program continued to work. For the past four months, actually. The understanding among a number of us, as I'm not the only one (I've spoken to other colleagues today), is that when the license runs out you cannot UPDATE. Not that the program WOULD STOP WORKING. Microsoft programs don't STOP WORKING just because you don't have the latest version. You may want to have someone update this. Like you could have someone update the prices. It's not exactly enticing to see a page that says 90 euros but when you click it turns out to be 175, so close to double. Tacky ... So, yes, I take issue with your lack of information and lack of updates or even a newsletter saying, hey folks ... you don't update and you're screwed. My agenda here is warning my colleagues so they don't get stuck on a Friday night with a Monday deadline. You have my email address, just as you have millions of others. So why didn't you just tell us? I have spoken to colleagues who have been working on allegedly expired licenses. No one knew. Catch my drift? As to support, Dominique personally deserves immense praise for his patience and willingness to help. But your own message says a lot about what your company is now about. I guess that's the way of the world. Catherine [Edited at 2012-05-25 19:56 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | about those "warnings" | May 25, 2012 |
Armorel,
you got that in the email that delivered your license. That email hasn't changed for years now:
= = = = =
Print and keep this document. You may need it in three years when renewing your license. To review your license status (expiry date, etc.), log in at www.wordfast.net > support > login with the access codes shown bel... See more Armorel,
you got that in the email that delivered your license. That email hasn't changed for years now:
= = = = =
Print and keep this document. You may need it in three years when renewing your license. To review your license status (expiry date, etc.), log in at www.wordfast.net > support > login with the access codes shown below:
Login : [email protected]
Password: irascibleguy
Please read the Wordfast User License Agreement (http://www.wordfast.net?whichpage=agreement). This short document explains the allowances for multiple installations of Wordfast applications on different computers, and/or the re-licensing of an application if you change computer, format your hard disk, etc.
= = = =
This is in addition to your specifying having read the EULA before buying.
When you log in at www.wordfast.net (the hotline re-sends your credentials immediately upon request), you are informed of your license status, and/or the need to renew the license.
We're mass-mailing shy. I've done that way back when (2003 or 2004) a couple times... and been flamed. You send emails? You're bad. You don't? You're bad.
But hey. We did send a general round of emails late 2010 (or was it 2009. Time flies) because there was a sharp price increase on Jan 1st, and a special renewal deal. Of course, those were sent to the email you provided when buying (still valid?); and may have ended up in your spam box, but here, we can't do anything. So despite flaming, we keep mass mailing here and there.
> Can someone tell me where it is
The obvious place, try www.wordfast.net > log in.
Cheers,
YC
Armorel Young wrote:
In many similar situations (e.g. when your Proz membership is about to expire!) you get emailed a warning in very ample time to enable you to renew. I can't understand why this isn't the case with Wordfast.
Personally I have looked and looked and looked for information in Wordfast as to when my licence expires, so that I don't get caught out by it suddenly locking up on me, but I can't find the information anywhere. Can someone tell me where it is? ▲ Collapse
| | | | Selcuk Akyuz
Turcja
Local time: 10:23
angielski > turecki
+ ...
| | Post removed: This post was hidden by a moderator or staff member for the following reason: |
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| Post removed: This post was hidden by a moderator or staff member for the following reason: | | 3-years limitation vs. lifelong product updates | May 26, 2012 |
Selcuk Akyuz wrote:
And at least the product works in demo mode (500 segments) and there is the free online version.
In addition to that, what Catherine failed to report is that I suggested she downgraded to version 5.92m (which is still available for download), gave me her install number and I would provide her with the corresponding license number. This was my idea of going the extra mile so as to allow her to continue using her expired license in full mode with her ongoing project. I probably shouldn't mention it, as I may get fired for exceeding my powers. Anyway, we did that, and Catherine responded (after 11 emails exchanged on a Friday evening) it was working.
Selcuk Akyuz wrote:
On the other hand, why should one "buy" a software with 3-years limitation, never heard about another CAT tool with "no charge for lifelong product updates"?
As I see it, what really matters is the total amount of money you will be charged over the years. Wordfast has chosen to ask for a smaller amount of money upfront, but to ask for more every three years. The other CAT tool you mention has chosen to ask for a higher amount upfront, but nothing else during the lifespan of the product.
Let's take the example of Catherine: she paid 180 euros in 2004, and then 90 euros in 2009. That's a total of 270 euros for using Wordfast from 2004 to 2012 (8 years). If she had purchased the other CAT tool in 2004, she would have paid 990 euros. That's almost four times more. Even after the 175 euros she's now being asked to pay (for the right to use Wordfast until 2015), the total amount would be 270 + 175 = 445 euros, which is still less than half the upfront price of the other tool.
Now, the vendor of the other tool decided to lower the upfront price from 990 euros to 690 euros in 2011. And this month it decided to lower it further from 690 to 590 euros. Even that is still more than what Catherine would pay for the use of Wordfast from 2004 to 2015.
[Edited at 2012-05-26 04:06 GMT]
| | | | Catherine Bolton
Local time: 09:23
włoski > angielski
+ ...
NOWY TEMAT In Memoriam | Use it every day | May 26, 2012 |
Natalie wrote: Catherine Bolton wrote:
Fine, I go to the support site to regenerate a license as they suggest, and it says that my license expired in January 2012.
...My license runs out in January but you decide to pull the plug on me on a Friday night (4 months later) with no advance warning? Do I take it correctly that you haven't used Wordfast since January? If it is so, you cannot blame anyone that you received no license expiration warning: such messages are sent at appropriate time when you use your software. In case the software is not used the license are not checked at the server and messages are not triggered.
No, Natalie,
I use it every day. That's why I was so surprised that it suddenly stopped. Had I known, I would have budgeted for it back in January. But I do not have the money right now because of a number of personal reasons.
Catherine
| | | | | Post removed: This post was hidden by a moderator or staff member for the following reason: |
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Heinrich Pesch
Finlandia
Local time: 10:23
Członek ProZ.com
od 2003
fiński > niemiecki
+ ...
| Ever heard of credit cards? | May 26, 2012 |
Catherine Bolton wrote:
No, Natalie,
I use it every day. That's why I was so surprised that it suddenly stopped. Had I known, I would have budgeted for it back in January. But I do not have the money right now because of a number of personal reasons.
Catherine
I always pay by Visa. How else business is done these days? And I think a professional translator should have more than one tool ready available. So that when one stops working work can go on by importing the tm and using another software.
The problem with Wordfast from a business point of view seems to be that their old versions were so good that updating is not really necessary for most of us users. But a business cannot go on if no-one pays for new products.
I didn't even know that one can use Wf after three years are up. I'm totally satisfied with the renewal policy of Wordfast.
| | | | | Price of renewal in 2009 vs. 2012 | May 26, 2012 |
Catherine Bolton wrote:
Dominique, your post here is the very one that says 90 euros.
As Yves said in another post, there was a substantial price increase in 2010. The cost of a renewal is 50% of the list price of a new license at the time of renewal. A new Classic license currently costs 350 euros, which is why a renewal in 2012 costs 175 euros. 90 euros was the price you paid in 2009.
[Edited at 2012-05-26 09:42 GMT]
| | | | | You see now? | May 26, 2012 |
Communication is fundamental in business.
All this fuss for nothing.
I've learned my lesson,
Well, I hope so. Miscommunication can be a disaster for all parties involved.
I'd rather expect apologies.
And you might admire Yves', Yasmin's and Dominique's patience. You'll never get this service elsewhere.
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